Saracens

Steve-The-Sarrie says:

WEEEELL, We should have started with Jackson on the Pitch, and Haughton also played well when on... if we have any chance of winning The GP, Start Using Jackson and throw out the Rotation Crap and use the best guys!

14 Mar 2010 - 18:21 - (Report this post)

Pete G says:

Having just watched the match on Sky I must say that our lack of experience as a team in scoring trys really showed up. The "go for a drop goal if you're remotely close enough" instruction means that the players are missing out on the phases of play leading to, & scoring a try. Our only one being scored from a line out on the 5 meter line. Dr Venter your strategy worked early on in the season but now it's been sussed out & the rest of the teams have had more experience in finishing than us. You desperately need to change things otherwise we'll be mid table at the end. I must just add well done guys for your commitment today.

14 Mar 2010 - 18:40 - (Report this post)

hutch48gr8 says:

Richard Skuse cost us, again. If he didn't get binned we could have sustained the pressure. Oh, and the rotation system isn't working!!! I wouldn't be surprised if we don't make the play offs and Bath squeeze into fourth!!

14 Mar 2010 - 18:41 - (Report this post)

TheDude says:

Have to say Northampton didn't beat us the Ref did!

14 Mar 2010 - 18:42 - (Report this post)

Le Chef says:

Why do we put up with this crap week in week out. Get rid of the coach and get someone who wants the team to win and not someone who is only interested in rotation

14 Mar 2010 - 18:50 - (Report this post)

jimbo007 says:

wow, that was very very poor. i miss the good old days when there was a real spirit around the ground, and even though we did not win every game, you always went to the vicaridge in a posotive mood.!!! i loved arriving at the ground to the sound of ABC 123, as my hero Glenda knocks over a kick. Or seeing del boy sprint to the line. All i can hear now is the endless boo's and the sound of 'who are you' by the who, as derick hoofhard gets the ball anyone agree?

14 Mar 2010 - 19:05 - (Report this post)

Eric Browett says:

We weren't very, very poor today. Saints were better than us. However, i do agree that the the sense of fun has gone from watching Saracens. I bought tickets for today and in the end couldn't be arsed to travel. That's never happened before but i just couldn't see us winning and if we lost I wanted to see us playing some good rugby. Didn't really see that until the last 10 minutes.

14 Mar 2010 - 19:12 - (Report this post)

jimbo007 says:

fair play. we did have some promising passages of play esecailly through goody

14 Mar 2010 - 19:41 - (Report this post)

The Bard says:

They have now won 47 out of their last 48 home games, so it would have taken a near miracle. I thought we did well today, but are sadly lacking the big forwards to provide a platform.

14 Mar 2010 - 20:20 - (Report this post)

Bynesey says:

I agree witht The dude, just like last years game in the cup against the Saints some dubious refereeing decisions, Chris Wyles for example was not in touch as the replay showed quite clearly, what the hell where the touch judges looking at, the ref was penalising us for things then letting Saints get away with exactly the same things no bias at all.

14 Mar 2010 - 20:46 - (Report this post)

keno payne says:

yes the ref was poor, but you win games with ball in hand not in the air.We showed we can run with the ball need to do it all the time and keep out of the bin.

14 Mar 2010 - 21:39 - (Report this post)

David A says:

Yes, the ref was poor; yes, the tactics let us down; yes, our discipline let us down. The fight shown in the last 20 was a credit and the running in the last 10 showed what might have been. Did anybody also read Burwell's programme notes, praising the Saints fans and what they mean to the club...very refreshing - I only read Nigel complaining the fans don't do enough in spreading the word or Edward 'Look at me in the tabard' Griffiths criticising anybody who gives voice to their frustration at what they're seeing (and paid for).

14 Mar 2010 - 22:25 - (Report this post)

6116alex says:

I think as a crowd we have made our feelings quite clear now. I'd like to see us get behind the players now. Booing your players will not make them play better. The mood at VR is poor at the moment and i cant see a change of plan, so in the few remaining games we, the fans, can make a difference. At the football team i also follow we are known for being louder when we are loosing!! and it works!!

15 Mar 2010 - 01:25 - (Report this post)

Baz says:

Well, whaddya know? I thought that was a better performance from Sarries than I've seen all season. Seriously! There was spirit, there was intent, hell, we even played some rugby! Despite a (relatively small) number of risible droppie efforts, Hoofhard must've run more and passed more in the one game than he did for the whole of the preceding season. The scrum was better too; OK, there were a couple of glitches, but we did even win some scrum pens and free kicks ourselves. Bottom line though: three yellow cards = lost game. Clearly Skuse needs to spend some time getting splinters in his a**e on Venter's instructions, not the refs'. I thought Venter would berate them afterwards for going "off message", but he didn't. So, more of the same please Doc (except without the cards). Honestly, I can put up with defeats if we've actually tried to win the game, what I can't stand is when we simply refuse to play (and I don't care then if we win or lose, it's rubbish either way). Also 10/10 to Saints, it was a great day out, great supporters, good welcome, good banter. Me and the missus were sat in the middle of the enemy support, and they loved our hopeless but non-stop efforts to out-shout them. Good on 'em. At the end of the match, a Stains fella with his wife and young daughter stopped us to tell us how much he loved our flags, so we gave one of them to him. Nice.

15 Mar 2010 - 06:39 - (Report this post)

Bloubul says:

Ok, lets forget the LV= cup and start focusing on the next game against the Falcons. Reaching the semis is a great effort and good experience picked up for when we find ourselves in another semi. Good comeback from the guys in the front, some real improvements. The running of the ball looked great, and gaps opened up. I just thought we need the finishing touches, a plan, a goal line attack or something. We looked a bit clueless when we came close to the line.

15 Mar 2010 - 09:33 - (Report this post)

saintsalive says:

Can I just say that in terms of the atmosphere and general banter at the game yesteday it was great fun and good to see so much support from all the Sarries fans. Rather than go on about the game I thought I would share some post match discussions between two sets of support and that was we thought that in many ways we have been similar clubs in the past as we have both flattered on occasions but never really got to build on momentum and deliver some ongoing success. We feel at the Gardens thats about to change with JM and DW at the helm we are buying quality English talent and developing the local lads alongside these - there is some way to go but in the last 10 years I have never felt of heard consistently the same amount of excitement from our fans - we have tried many variations including a disasterous SA lead coaching team that ultimately put us into Div 1 ! - my main fear now is that JM and DW are building the next england team and they will soon get the call to Twickers to finish the job ! - anyway long post sorry to bore you but hope you sort it out you have some realy quality in the team maybe see you in the playoffs

15 Mar 2010 - 09:59 - (Report this post)

bigmal50 says:

I always enjoy going to Saints even if i knew we were on a hiding to nothing. started the game well enough except for trying silly drop goals again even winning some scrums but as the game went on we began to lose direction again. Scrum started losing its way although sin bin didn't help but even when we kept the ball in hand we still had no idea on how to break the gameline unlike saints who everytime they got the ball quick hands good running lines chip or kick when need to and tries come. I don't think their players are better quality than us but they play with instinct as rugby players should do and i'm afraid BV stifles our players with ridiculous limitations and so called game plans. We will be very lucky to come away this season with even a Heineken place. We need BV to go and then get a coach who knows rugby and is a little flexible so please BV walk away and make Saracens a happy club again or their won't be many renewing their season tickets next year!!

15 Mar 2010 - 11:33 - (Report this post)

suebrice says:

We too were in the middle of the Church Stand with the Northampton Supporters - and boy how they support their team, but the Sarries supporters made a real impact with the noise, flags and balloons. The team worked extremely hard and its the best we have seen them play for ages, Alex Goode had yet another great game and the whole team seemed to want to play with the ball in hand - once again we gave away possession by trying the drop goal tactic and it seemed with Hoouguard on the pitch we do not have the same sparkle or desire to play as when Jackson is at No 10. I felt we could have won yesterday if we played with the ball in hand - its also gutting when the Northampton supporters say we are boring and all we can do is kick the ball - Sarries are better than that but the players must be allowed to play. !

15 Mar 2010 - 12:37 - (Report this post)

swampygeoff says:

No plan A let alone a plan B! Now after yesterdays great turn out by the travelling support will the senior management shut up whinging about the fans!!!!!! That result yesterday is exactly the reason why the crowds aren't improving at Watford...not the ground.....not the facilities.....not the travelling. The game was always gonna be very difficult but the boys gave a good account of themselves but for idotic and brainless sendings off it may have been closer (not different sadly) ?! So many things to address most of all our discipline how can you ever expect to win a semi-final when you have to play a quarter of the game with 14 men. EW and NR you worry about the money and let the fans express themselves what ever way they wish we pay the wages and lets face it if we weren't in such a dire pit of form we wouldn't have to express ourselves in such ways. This season is fading into obscurity fast and unless issues are addressed fast EW's 'grand plan' for the club will fall at the first hurdle!!

15 Mar 2010 - 13:29 - (Report this post)

mblunden says:

It was a poor effort honestly sinbins not with standing.Missing dropgoals from the halfway line is no substitute for scoring tries..where's the running gone?At this rate they may as well move on to Wembley,Fulham or whereever becuase the fans are fed up...

15 Mar 2010 - 13:42 - (Report this post)

Stu says:

I predict we won't make the top 4, we have tough games away and have lost the winning way. 12 years as a season ticket holder, a Saracens through and through, but I'm 50/50 about renewing next season. Didn't win at Northampton, didn't deserve to.

15 Mar 2010 - 14:11 - (Report this post)

paul heale says:

We need to get back to the way Saracens have always played,exciting running Rugby,true we may not always win but at least it was enjoyable.The way we are playing at the moment is no fun to watch.I agree with the above 50/50 about renewing our 3 season tickets.

15 Mar 2010 - 14:24 - (Report this post)

Baz says:

50/50 in my household: I'm very doubtful about renewing, the missus wants to. However, if they can build on the signs of enterprise shown yesterday, I might yet be won round. I honestly will not mind if we lose every game remaining this season, just so long as Venter and the team give the fans something to cheer and be proud of. But if we go right back to the anti-rugby we've played for most of the season, I shall certainly vote with my feet, regardless of our ultimate league position.

15 Mar 2010 - 15:17 - (Report this post)

bigmal50 says:

Management read on!!! you are losing the support and commitment of the supporters if you haven't already. We will be averaging 3 or 4,000 a home game if this continues. Last year i twinned my club with Sarries and was going to twin another club this season but i would be embarrased to promote the club the way it is. Their are many supporters considering their options on season tickets for next season so management do something quick and lets not lose our great club to this boring and pointless BV philosophy on rugby, times running out. Andy Goode was slated on the super 14 game the other week by the commentators when they said "we can see what sort of fly half he is, kick kick kick send him back to England" next game i saw him in he hardly kicked a ball and became a vastly improved player and gained the praise of the pundits, take note English rugby as a whole lets learn from the super 14's and play ball in hand and attract back the crowds.

15 Mar 2010 - 15:26 - (Report this post)

Treach says:

It's great to read about the Saints hospitality for this match, but, crikey, when you take a look at the Saints Fans Forum, a fair number of them seem to have an intense dislike for our club and us fans. Take for example, a post by saintsalive, obviously a different saintsalive to the above, who wrote: "The thought of sitting at FG, a proper rugby club/ground with proper rugby supporters, with a whole load of flag waving, finger wiggling, kazoo blowing, fez wearing, football mentality muppets really does not appeal." To be fair, this person backtracked a bit in a later posting, but are Sarries fans that bad??

15 Mar 2010 - 16:21 - (Report this post)

Baz says:

Internet forums seem to attract jerks, you wouldn't catch me on one (I'm not sure I've thought this through LOL!) But anyway, the real human beings up in Northampton put their tiny minority of whining internet-based brethren to shame.

15 Mar 2010 - 16:28 - (Report this post)

Stu says:

I don't mind the team loosing, someone has too, but as long as they have given it their all and played good hard rugby. Then simply the best team won on the day, but the last lot of matches have lacked alot of passion which we started the season with. The funny thing is I got relocated with work and been living in Northampton for the last 8 years making the trip down to watford each time, you can imagine the stick i'm currently getting...

15 Mar 2010 - 16:44 - (Report this post)

Janie says:

I don't know if any of the players read this but would just like to say that they always seem to give it their all and, winning or losing, I still love 'em! Good game yesterday, looking forward to the return of Borthwick though. It would be great if we could make Vicarage Road a fortress next season and build on the fantastic support which already exists here. Well played Guys :)

15 Mar 2010 - 20:19 - (Report this post)

popeye says:

Some of you people need to stop whinging and support the team. We are still in with a playoff shot. To predict we are not going to make the playoffs, is not supportive or helpful to the players. I'm sure there are some of them who read these comments, and I don't see how telling them they're not good enough is going to help. What a few people seem to have forgotten is that we were missing 10 players either injured, or on international duty for this game. You may argue that some of that 10 wouldn't have started the game, but I count seven of the 10 who would have been it the matchday 23. There is no doubt we are missing the front row we had at the start of the season (Gill and Nieto), with Brits being the linchpin. Borthwick (like him or not) has been a very good captain and leader this season. I though we struggled in the scrums, and there was only a few forwards who really stood out. Burger was by far the best player we had on the pitch, considering they weren't sure he would be fit enough to start. And Hayden Smith continues to get better week on week. I though Barritt and Ratuvou did well with the ball they got, and Goodey as always was on top form. Although Rod did a good job for us, I think we missed Cato on Sunday. I'm really looking forward to a top classs front row next season, and I'm hoping that BV will find a world class winger. No offence to the guys but someone with real experience on the wing, and a potent try scorer wouldn't go a miss. Well played Sarries, heres to a home playoff!

16 Mar 2010 - 13:58 - (Report this post)

Baz says:

Some of you people need to stop telling the rest of us what to think, say and do. I was at FG on Sunday, where I roared myself hoarse and waved my flag 'til my arms ached, so I don't need any lectures on supporting the team. But it remains my opinion that we have played appalling rugby this season (mainly due to the coach and his game plan rather than the players), and I will continue to say so for as long as that continues (although, as I said above, I was encouraged by Sunday's efforts).

16 Mar 2010 - 14:26 - (Report this post)

maynas says:

Looking at the remaining matches our run in to stay in a play off position is very hard but not impossible. On the brighter side one home match at VR (Newcastle) which we ought to win, one pseudo home game at Wembley against Harlequins, that we could win and an an away game at Sale we might win , though they will be fighting really hard to avoid relegation. 3 away games at Northampton, Gloucester and Leicester unfortunately all look likely defeats on current form. Irish have Wasps & Gloucester away, Saints,Leeds, Worcester and Sale at home Wasps have Irish and Gloucester at home and Sale, Saints, Worcester and Newcastle away, plus at least one Amlin Cup game, maybe more. Bath have Saints, Harlequins, Leeds and Sale at home and only Leicester and Wasps away , the latter at Twickenham. Play with the results how you like but it looks to me like Irish have the easiest set of games, Bath (needing to catch up a lot of points of Sarries and v tough away games too) so likely it comes down to can Wasps keep up their recovery in 2 competitions. Sarries win your home games and pick up some losing bonus points on the road and you may just stay in the top 4, but it would be so much easier if it had taken us 1 and not 4 games to score 4 tries on average this year. If we makethe semi, likely Leicester, possibly Northampton, away, so some markers to lay down in those 2 away matches in April.

16 Mar 2010 - 15:01 - (Report this post)

bigmal50 says:

Maynas forever the optomist!!! On this sort of form can you see us surviving a top 4 position and even if by some miracle Wasps & Bath slipped up could you see us beating Leicester,or Northampton?? i dont think so!! And Popeye we carry on supporting the players it is the management thats lost the plot. We have lost players through injury and International call up but so has everyone yet they don't complain and carry regardless. BV is running out of people to blame for our performances and it is him who's taking the "p" out of us all and causing the rift. This is the first season i have not been to at least 75% of the home and away games so the amount of money some of us spend and have spent on this club we are entitled to our opinions!

16 Mar 2010 - 16:17 - (Report this post)

philiptigg says:

Yes, sack another coach, and start another 3 year plan. Why not, we have been doing it for 10 years plus now, so why not do it again??? We can all see how that has brought the club unrivalled success.... oh no, wait, it hasn't! Mallinder and West have been at Saints for 3 years now, our coaching staff for 8/9 months. Perspective please! Are you glory fans? Is being a fan easy? This club is trying to grow on and off the field. Why not get behind the club and support its move forwards? Maybe I am an optimist too, but I am also a realist and understand that Rome wasn't built in a day, a team never built after 6 months, etc etc, and if you were all realists, you too would realise kicking another set off coaches out of the club would just hold the club back again. Why not look at how the club has been attracting the likes of Tonga'huia away from Saints? And Wigglesworth, and Kelly Brown? There is a great set up off the field for players and players families, and this will come across on the field, but it doesn't happen over night. Can you blame Edward Griffiths for being positive? He isn't going to tell us he doesn't think we aren't any good, etc, etc, and by booing, not going, etc, we are doing that. We need to get behind the team. And also, previous Sarries teams would have capitulated after conceding 4 tries. All credit to the effort shown by Sarries on Sunday for continuing the fight and keeping going to the death.

16 Mar 2010 - 18:48 - (Report this post)

Baz says:

For God's sake, here's another one trying to tell us all what to think and that we're not "proper" fans. "Glory fans" indeed. How dare you! Especially since you, presumably, are one of those around here whose mantra is "who cares how we play just so long as we win". So just who here is the glory fan? And who the hell do you think you are to make that judgement anyway when you know nothing about the people you are attacking, how long they might have been supporting Sarries, how they might have suffered through long years of ups and (mostly) downs, and how much hard-earned cash they have sunk into the pursuit? But I'm not going to parade *my* credentials for your approval, because to do so would simply validate your arrogant assumption that you have the right to sit in judgement over me. But I will say this: I do not have rose-tinted spectacles; I have my eyes open and can see that the emperor has no clothes; I have never signed an inviolable contract to support Sarries regardless of the contempt they display for the paying public in playing the world's most tedious brand of non-rugby; I can think of better things to do on a Sunday afternoon than watch a ball being hoofed into the air for 80 minutes; I am willing and able to see Sarries lose (God knows I've seen enough of it in the past) just so long as what they do on the field (as on last Sunday) makes me proud to be a Sarrie rather than embarrassed; I don't buy this "building for the future" cr@p, especially since we all thought we already had a solid long-term plan in place when this lot parachuted in and tore it up; and rubbish rugby is rubbish rugby: Venter has the materials at his disposal to play good rugby *right now*, that we don't is not because he needs years to figure out how to, it's simply because he chooses for us not to.

17 Mar 2010 - 06:35 - (Report this post)

philiptigg says:

I do not tell you what to think. I simply implore you to realise the blocks that are being put in place to make this a successful club for the long term, consistently winning trophies, rather than a semi final club. We have a CEO in place who knows what he is doing with a rugby club. We have backers who have the financial clout that will more than likely stop this club going under, and they are in this for the long haul. They need the long term fans to stick with the club, otherwise that base of the clubs fanship disappears. Venter has brought a steeliness to the the club. 12/24 months ago, having conceded 4 tries, we would have shipped another 4. Remember Glos away? Instead we fought back. That was also the first, and only time hopefully, we have conceded 4 tries in a game this season. This club is improving on and off the field, and WE (yes we, as fans, who support the club) need to be together to help this club go forward, and it pains me reading about all these people who just want to up and go. Seriously, if Venter goes, we start again, then the next coach will go, and the next, and the next. Stability is needed, and it is coming, but great teams dont appear overnight. Roman Abramovich has put millions into Chelsea, and they still can't win his dream, the champions league. Sport is just not that easy. I don't want your credentials as a fan. Every fan is equal, we all pay, etc, etc, but I want us all to pull together, and not boo, because the good times are going to come to this club, but its and upward curve, and the club needs its supporters to get behind it. A year ago, all the press was about a London SA. We were told it was false, and it was false. Goode, Saull, Cato, signed up. Wigglesworth, Stevens, Kelly Brown, Tonga'huia signed up. These are quality players approaching their peaks. They would not be coming if they questionned the direction the club was going. We have to trust, yes trust, the direction the club is going too. If these players can put their livelihood and bodies on the line for us, then we can do the same for them.

17 Mar 2010 - 09:58 - (Report this post)

Malcolm Denton says:

Well done Philliptigg. At long last a sensible comment.I wii renew my season ticket this year as i am a Saracen and will support the team trough thick and thin. At long last we have a management team with vision for the future. The building blocks are in place and the cement is drying on a firm foundation. Lets stop all this negativity and offer constructive comments to boost the team. We are all in this together and with a few more wins this season we will set ourselves up for a great 2010/2011. Just wish EG would comment on the official site as well as the unofficial site as we are all Saracens and as members should have the same comments expressed by him. Stand Up

17 Mar 2010 - 15:24 - (Report this post)

bigmal50 says:

How the hell can you say it is improving on the pitch when all i see week after week is another dismall performance inept in every way and worse than the week before. If BV has tactics then after all this time he should realise they don't work and if he can't change his tactics and game plan then he isn't a coach!!! Yes we have the players and some very good youngsters playing a brand of so called rugby that is foreign to them Philliptigg i wonder if you've ever played rugby and stood on that wing in the freezing cold week in week out waiting for your chance to do something creative and then only ever receiving hospital passes when options run out or expecting to tackle. Be real about this BV is splitting this club wide open and turning fan against fan. I like Baz go along to see rugby and have been their through the good and bad years and i may add mainly bad but still go back and follow the club to Wales, Ireland, Newcastle, France and all other far flung areas and until this season watched good entertaining rugby, even when Diamond was in charge at least the rugby was still entertaining, i have never seen so many dismayed supporters and heard the players booed as much as they have this year and that is not the players fault ell most of them as they haven't changed since last year its the managements fault. Their are no building blocks because the foundations have gone rotten and crumbled. Open your eyes and see this is the worst for performances we have ever been!!

18 Mar 2010 - 10:40 - (Report this post)

philiptigg says:

Bigmal50, we will have to agree to disagree, as my only comment i can say in response is: Open your eyes and see the building blocks being put in place for a long term building plan, not some short term quick fix. I am not going to repeat myself from previous posts to make this point. Malcolm Denton recognises what is going on, I wish everyone else did too!

18 Mar 2010 - 11:16 - (Report this post)

bigmal50 says:

We can bring he best players in the world in as i have already stated but unless we get a coach who understands them players and understands what Saracens is about and that isn't boring the fans to death then we will go nowhere. Perhaps Phil you see something i don't but i know a lot of the players are unhappy with whats going on as much as the fans are and that is why we aare losing players and once we start losing young talent we have to start worrying. I have been going regularly for 10 years now ever since i retired from playing and have regular conversations with players and i can assure you a lot do not feel their are any foundations being laid, and i'm not saying that at the start of the season that isn't what was happening, but now the whole ethos of Saracens and our proud name is being dismantled on the pitch which spills over to the terraces. We are a poor side with good players but very poor management, everyone outside the club can see it as well as most within the club!!! All i want to know is has BV been sent to us via Wasps to infiltrate and destroy us???

19 Mar 2010 - 13:12 - (Report this post)

philiptigg says:

Come on then, you say you know people who are unhappy...spill the names, quotes, etc. Impart your wisdom on us all!

19 Mar 2010 - 17:37 - (Report this post)